Admit You’re DTF – It’s Okay, We Understand!

Is being DTF a bad thing?

Is describing yourself

as friends with benefits more acceptable?

Are

perpetually in the friend zone?

Do you think swingers hide behind these labels, but they’re secretly all DTF?

I don’t know. I

to

think so.

And here’s why.

The dictionary definition says that DTF is an

indication of willingness for a sexual encounter.

Well, that sounds like all swingers.

Right? Aren’t we all willing? Like, isn’t that the

whole point that we’re all willing to have sex with somebody

else? Yes. 100%.

So

in the swinger community, DTF is

thought of as differently.

Yeah. I think the definition that people have in

their minds is more a willingness to have sex with anybody who’s breathing. Yeah. Keys in

the bowl, hike it to the bedroom, and get down to business.

Anybody, anywhere, anytime.

Yes. And that is the furthest from.

Yeah.

I think we can break down some DTF examples

of how it’s probably a little different than that understanding.

Yeah. So let’s just say how DTF is beneficial. Right? Talking can be awkward. A lot of

talking can be awkward. It can be laborious. Maybe you don’t

know what to say.

Maybe you’re the, you know, some kid’s soccer game or something, and then you get nervous because you’re like, oh, I’m not supposed to talk about that. I’m not supposed to talk. Keep it

it sexy. Keep it sexy. Don’t go into politics. Don’t talk about the

the kids. Like, what are you supposed to connect on? Right?

Right? Right. DTF also saves time.

And DTF

is always new, exciting, and

novel. Not to say that friends with

benefits can’t be that way,

And I think that that novelty aspect of kind of walking into a party and being open

to sex with anyone

really does kind of open up that NRE, that

hunt, the chase, that sense of kind of conquest. That you get when you kind of walk into a nightclub and you see somebody sexy

across the room and you go, “I wonder if they’d be

interested in having sex.” It’s that hookup culture.

Right. That goes back to your dating life and what it was like to be in your 20s

and you’re at the… Absolutely. Right. Never met them before, haven’t had a conversation.

Do I have game enough…

Right. …to connect with that person that

they’d be willing to have sex? Yes.

Now, we have the hookup culture and

the hookup culture is a

very empowering attitude towards sex. Sure.

But it does come with a stigma

absolutely is some

level of stigma in

the Swinger community towards DTI.

At least from the perspective of people

who need to be friends first.

It’s the other

side of the point, right? It’s the dark side, if you will, of swinging. Right.

there’s that devaluing of this pursuit.

Yeah, I think the way I would describe it is…

There’s a more

noble pursuit of being friends with someone,

really getting to know them, bonding

with them, going to chili cookouts with them,

that makes it not

dirty. That makes it cheap and easy. Oh. But that’s interesting. So do you think people

label themselves as friends with benefits because the DTF is dirty

and they’re already doing something dirty and secretive and… I think it’s a little bit of

a buffer from that stigma,

that easy, the slut-shaming aspect of what DTF is.

Interesting. I wonder if that has something to do with it.

dig into that a little bit.

with benefits. Okay, let’s say that that is a more noble pursuit. Let’s say that that’s the better way to go, right? Because just being

a slut and having sex with anybody is just bad.

How do you qualify or quantify friendship? What is friendship at a house party?

Right. Do you have

to wait until the second date to have sex

with somebody?

Is this a five

minute conversation or is this like you’ve seen them at event after event after event and six months later then you

can finally have sex? Right.

Yeah. If you go to a desire resort and you’re there for a whole week,

do you have to wait till Thursday night before you leave? Or

is it okay to have sex with somebody sooner

than that? Right. And if

it’s sooner than are you actually DTF?

Right. Exactly. And nobody has

that. But everyone’s quick to label.

Nobody. Nobody can define it. But everyone’s quick to label

it. Right.

And I fully

understand that people want an interaction between two individuals to mean more

and they want to trust you because you are opening your precious

relationship to another couple. And of course you want them to

be respectful and caring towards

your spouse or other significant person.

I think a lot of the stigma around DTF versus friends with benefits comes

comes down to the body count issue and not feeling like a number.

And I think that they actually have

a personality and there’s a connection with those people.

And I think a lot of that that

that connection aspect.

almost an emotional connection. Right. We’ve talked about this before where.

It’s a little bit of an emotional connection with people.

The sex is usually better. Yeah. And it

it’s really more specifically the

intimacy with another person. It’s not like you’re getting attached to them but you are sharing and very intimate moment.

can be some tenderness there. There can be some

some petting and some cuddling after there’s kind words.

There’s sexy things said. There’s all kinds of

intimate things that are occurring.

And I think a lot of the intimacy I think that you and I really enjoy is

the kind of letting your guard down a little bit

and having fun. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Because

feel comfortable enough with that person to just be yourself.

And I think that’s that’s another one of those aspects of the friends part

is that you can kind of hang out with your friends. So you’re yourself right.

You’re not putting on a facade. You’re not putting on.

Right. This persona of whatever. Right. But

we have had experiences in

the past where we’ve

been in DTF situations and we’ve laughed and asked for people’s names

afterwards. And we’ve had a really great time.

So and even though we get their contact information we never hear from them again. Right.

Probably because this is another big

advantage of DTF.

They got out of the lifestyle. Yeah. They tried it once. Yeah. So we would never have the chance to actually become friends with them because

over time they disappear.

Right. And that was it. That was your one. Your

one shot opportunity which is why DTF worked

in those situations.

Absolutely.

Two hours to get to know somebody

and.

And with them and then they’re out. Yep.

And we’ll go through that whole list of other reasons why

DTF really worked for us.

There is also stigmas around women slut shaming and body counts.

It’s I think that is pervasive in

people’s minds still even though they may not think about it.

It’s it’s a perception that’s

in the back of your head about how women should be and how they should own their sexuality.

And when we started swinging I didn’t

really step into my own sexuality until we started swinging. And I realized how powerful my sexuality was and I owned that and I could ask for what I wanted and I could

tell people what I liked.

But.

That I hadn’t I mean

that that happened when I was in my.

What 40s.

Late 40s.

I mean and and I’ve had a lot of sexual experiences but the Swinger community really brought that out of me

and it comfort. Yes.

Being able to express yourself.

Yeah. And because women are

the the gas and the brakes.

That sense of power that I had to control my environment was massive

and getting comfortable with that power took a hot hot second.

Yeah. It’s interesting. We’ve watched a couple of

documentaries recently talking about

sex and you

know loose mess if you

will. Right. From the

sociological standpoint but also from the

physiological standpoint. And

it’s interesting because

this misconception that

women who have sex all the time have loose vaginas.

Many who have sex all the time with men who have sex with men that the incontinence issue someone

brilliantly pointed out that those are muscles.

What happens when you exercise a muscle.

It gets stronger. Therefore it would actually get tighter. So the whole like Kegel exercise thing that’s exercising those muscles. Sex can do the

same thing. Orgasms are

a contraction of all of those muscles.

So having a lot of orgasms you’re working your muscles out. It’s not getting looser. I know. This was just more slut shaming of women over

centuries. It’s a horrible

mischaracter. I know. Does to you.

I think the other kind of mischaracterization that kind of goes with slut shaming is the disease factor. The STI.

But if you’re practicing safer sex.

If you’re using condoms. If you’re washing between partners. If you’re doing all the good

swing or etiquette things to kind of take care of yourself in a kind of random

environment.

You’re

cutting your risks down significantly.

Yeah. I mean condoms are pretty effective at stopping transmission of the disease. Yes.

Yes. Most STI’s. So.

100 percent. Not foolproof.

No. But. But it’s a lot safer than

than bear backing.

And.

What’s the other term we learned the other day? Oh yeah. We’re watching a hot dogging TV show.

Raw dogging. Raw dogging. Which is an

older term. But yeah. Raw dogging.

Raw dogging. Well we should bring that back. Just not do it. But just bring the term back. Yeah.

I don’t want to do that. Yes. I’ll only do that with you. Yeah. Raw. Raw.

So.

Some examples

of shaming. Sure. That

we’ve heard about in the lifestyle is someone said to us.

They’re they met this woman and they said well she said if you’re not an

an asshole and you avoid saying anything stupid. I’m just going to fuck you.

Which I think

is somewhat reasonable

if you think about it like you just met somebody

you’re you’re at a swimmer event.

And in context if you if you

just said well as long as the guy had an asshole and I’m

attracted to him why wouldn’t I have sex with them.

Yeah. That seems perfectly reasonable to me. It does seem perfectly reasonable to me.

And I think the

evaluation of whether someone is an asshole or not is

part of that getting to know them thing. Right. Just in a sense the one minute to five minute to 10 minute

friendship evaluation. Like

could you be friends with this person. Yeah. They’re not an asshole. I could get along with them. Right.

And so why would you put your value system on

somebody else because oh they didn’t spend in a whole hour

getting to know them. Maybe they only need five minutes

and hit it off. I mean everybody’s heard of love at first sight or that whole

NRE thing where they’re just like

across the bar sparks

flying. Yeah. Yeah.

Oh yeah.

Why not. You’re gonna go.

You know.

The next party. They’re not there.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yes. So you know a lot of people if if if they’re polite

and they’re consenting then they’re

they’re good to go. Yeah. Right. But I do understand a lot of people need more time. They need to have conversations and things like that.

kind of get some people’s perspective from the friends first point of view. It kind of goes back to this is a term that’s being fleshed out more and we’re starting to hear it more.

And that’s demisexual. That’s people who

need to have an emotional connection with someone before they have sex with them. I kind of get that. Especially if that’s

how you have sexual arousal. Right. You’re not aroused by someone unless you’re kind

of emotionally connected to them.

And I get just walking up to somebody that you don’t have any kind of emotional connection to them. But the question comes back to

how long does it take to build that emotional

connection that like I get this person.

Right.

What kinds

of things can happen in a conversation and to then label yourself as only demi or.

Or sapiosexual. Right. Where you need that

intellectual conversation to stimulate you. Right. Right. And I think

all of us to a certain degree are that.

I’m fairly certain that that’s a spectrum. Right. And that I certainly am comfortable having sex with random people.

Like I don’t have to know someone for a very long time to have sex

with them. But I certainly have to be attracted to them.

And a lot of my attraction has to do with. Are they funny.

Are they. Gaging.

Right. Maybe they’re a little assertive. Kind of like an assertive woman. Yeah.

Because it shows that they’ve got some

enthusiasm and some confidence and confidence is

sexy. Right. Right. To be able to see those characteristics of a person. Yeah. You can really build that. Spark. Yeah. That. That totally makes sense. I also think DTF is

very situational. So much.

Because your club environment versus your resort environment is going to be completely different. Yeah. The pace is different. Yes. So.

A nightclub is definitely. You know.

The bar closes at two. Yep.

So you got to make your moves fast. You got to find the people. There’s a lot of activity in a very small space. Yeah.

Chop chop. Yes. And the quality

of the connection is going to be different because in a club it’s a loud environment.

Right. So you really don’t have good conversations.

You can’t. You can’t have a good conversation.

They’re very surface. What? What?

Yeah. Huh?

That’s so funny. I can’t hear that at all. Exactly.

So I could imagine at

a resort it’s well we’ve

been to a resort. So yes we do know you

there are plenty of opportunities over breakfast

lunch dinner etc. Down by the beach whatever

at the pool. You’re lounging. You go for a

walk. Yes. You’re on an excursion with someone. Yes. You’re bonding over cocoa beans. Yes. Like I get it. I get it. So looking back

now that we’ve been swingers for 11 plus years our first experiences were very DTF

and a lot of that was the

area we live in.

We

don’t have clubs here.

Well there is one but it’s far away.

available in your area highly depends on really

how you swing. Your finances

We didn’t have money to get on a cruise.

We didn’t have money to go to an adult resort.

We were busy raising

kids. We didn’t have time to spend away.

So we relied on house parties. We relied

on

that were happening

four times a year. They had

the big Halloween, the New Year’s, the glow party

and something else.

That was it.

found ourselves in orgies a lot of the time and

we had a lot of fun and we really liked those

really DTF scenarios.

You’re not having a lot of conversation

with people. In fact sometimes you’re

not saying anything to that person

and we would

go and we would observe

orgies and sometimes we jump in. Sometimes we just

just sit and watch.

Sometimes someone

would give us a little come hither finger and

we’d participate.

But

they always started off gentle and

soft. They didn’t always turn into full. But we really

had some wonderful, caring, fun,

great experiences in orgies that were defined as DTF.

We didn’t know most of those

people. In fact we hadn’t even seen them until we

got in that room. Yeah there were a lot of times where we would do the mingle thing down

on the dance floor and we would

introduce ourselves and meet people but none of them were going to the playroom. So by the time we got up to the playroom and it was getting later, people would play really really late in the evening and we didn’t want

to wait. So we would just start

playing early or start playing before anybody else would head start and we would end up kind of stirring up the crowd and

getting people to join in with us and

there wasn’t a lot of conversation. No.

I mean you don’t want to kill the mood.

You have your basic conversation about here are my condoms, here are my lube, I like

this, I like this, this and this. I don’t want that,

that and that.

And you’re

good to go

The other thing I loved about orgies was people

are always talking about that synergy or we have to wait till the stars align and

when you know you know. Well

a lot of times we would walk into a room where the orgy was

and you could just feel the electricity and you

knew you wanted to be part of it.

You knew that you needed

to be in on that bed in the action.

And so we would we would step up

and we would ask politely can

we join or can I touch

and people would respond

respond whether they said yes

or no sometimes we would get a no sometimes they

said we’re only playing together.

now and it wasn’t yeah it wasn’t very often

but that that’s

where I think people are missing out on some really great opportunities to be DTF because

you’re missing out on those

moments right those electric moments that are that

people keep talking about. Right yeah that

once in a lifetime chance. Yes.

So in those in those situations

that we found ourselves in especially the

early ones which were very soft swap did

you ever feel like you weren’t being

cared for or that you were being

used.

No no because I had a voice I was still practicing how to use my

voice sometimes I was worried more about how others felt than how I felt

but I never felt like anyone was uncaring

or rude

or you know breaking any boundaries.

Yeah and I had the same

impression during those experiences everybody was

was very in tune

with each other. Yeah. There was a lot of

not and this was some

of the magic of what those early experiences were there was a lot of

nonverbal consent granted.

Yeah tell by their body language and

their facial expressions and how they approach you that they were respectful that they

wanted to participate but they you know were being

gentle. Yeah. Yeah I liked I liked those that was

a fun time it was a fun time. Good

good first few years after we got over the awkward. Oh yeah oh yeah that that right.

All right so

friends with benefits let’s talk about that.

This is defined as friends who’s trust

each other enough to engage in

sexual activity. Okay great.

Classic definition right and I

think the kind of the urban dictionary version is

hey you up.

Yeah.

So just that

friend you can call anytime and you’re so comfortable with them that you could just have sex with them at any

point. Right. Or not have sex

with them. Right. Although I think it tends to

be and you can answer this better than me people

who you predominantly call not

to hang out and be friends with but just to call for like a movie. Yeah the

friends with but yes and so

good point the friends with benefits not lifestyle is really it’s you like

a single person who you’re DTF with all the time. Yes yes you don’t go to dinner with them

you don’t hang out they don’t go to your kids soccer

soccer game. Yes.

It’s mostly the benefits.

Right but in the swinger

community it’s more heavy on

the friend side. Right. A lot more barbecues.

With a little bit of benefits.

So I

get this this friendship

aspect you know for women we we like to

feel safe right. Safety is key to feeling

erotic or allowing that eroticism to come

out and women experience safety differently in the world

than men do. And we

need a little bit of that emotion connection or that intimacy that we were talking about earlier.

So the safety is really key to that.

Yeah I mean it’s an invasive process especially if you’re talking about full

on penis in vagina

penetrative sex or or even oral sex about like for a guy it’s pretty external like everything’s on the outside.

We’re very internal. Everything’s very internal.

Yes so.

Yes.

Trust me. I know.

What is some of the

downsides of friends with benefits. I mean the safety is good. We talked about that. I mean it’s plus is what I don’t know how many other pluses you get to know them. There’s that trust in the caring and things like that. It

makes you feel comfortable. But the

downsides are. I think the

biggest downside that we’ve experienced with the friends with benefits and to be clear we’ve moved

out of the DTF. Yes sort

of. We’re swinging back towards the friends with benefits because

we want that deeper emotional connection. Yeah. This has been our struggle

with the whole finding friends in the lifestyle.

Yeah you go. We invest a

significant amount of time really getting to know someone and hanging out with them and spending

time with them and

then they get out of the lifestyle. Yeah.

They have their own thing. They’ve got to figure something out and not only do we not have the friends with benefits anymore. Yeah. A lot of times when people exit

from the lifestyle they exit. Yes.

They don’t talk to anybody in the lifestyle anymore.

They’re done done. Yeah. We’ve had friends we’ve talked about this before on the podcast.

We can’t even have go have dinner with them.

Right. They don’t call us for you know hot wings.

Or you get so friendly that you

start learning things about them that make

them less attractive like

maybe their political stance.

Yes.

And

sometimes especially in these days it can be a deal breaker for some couples. Yeah. Yeah.

And it’s disappointing and

a lot of people I know are saying well that’s

your mistake for you know talking politics. Well you know sometimes it just kind of

comes up casually

and people go there and you just try to stop the conversation from going there and it happens.

Or you just happen to stumble across their social media platform. Yeah. And their profile and then then it’s over which goes back to our whole thing which is like social media is fucking evil.

Because

it has the potential to ruin

a friendship with someone because now you’ve seen what they’ve pushed. Yeah. And it’s not that they interact with maybe the outside world. They may be really nice to you

but whatever their stance is you just

can’t stand for that. Right. And

it takes a lot of time to to build those swing our friendships. Your it’s weeks of of a build

up the the the chatting

online maybe the exchange of pictures trying

to coordinate a date with four people.

And

and then of course there’s getting ready setting the time picking the place.

Oh what does everybody want to eat that night right. People are

picky. And then you

get there and it gets to game day and it’s

it’s not so great. I mean I can’t tell you how many 20

hours invested in a friendship and you go and you finally meet him for dinner and you’re like

God I can’t wait to get out of here.

It’s like what a waste of my time.

Yeah. And I think a lot of that is one kind of like online flirting thing. Yeah. Real life flirting thing. Right.

But even if you’ve been on several dates with them especially

if you’re waiting right you’ve got this friends with benefits

mindset you you’re waiting to really get to know them. Yes. By the time you really do get to know them you don’t actually find them sexually right

because you know too much. It

gets in the way of having

fun sexually or

you’ve waited so long that you don’t

know how to transition anymore.

Yes.

And good friends which we’re going to talk about.

So too much talking never

get the fucking and the adult resorts sometimes.

They are great. They really are. You have a lot of time to get to

know somebody but sometimes. That’s a slippery

slope. Yeah. Because I think a lot

of people get so comfortable hanging out doing the pool activities and playing shuffleboard 100 percent. Forget that

they’re there to meet couples and hook up. Right. By the time they wake

up after their fourth all-nighter drink. Right. Karaoke bar piano dueling.

Yeah. They realize we’re going home in

two days. Fuck anybody.

Yeah. We just spent five grand to get here

and we. The Swinger tax and haven’t had

any swinging experience. Right.

And five grand is the conservative dollar amount.

Which.

You have. Yes. Where you flew from.

Right.

So.

Yes. If you’re not verbally expressing your interest and you’re not

making that proposal.

And you’re not sealing the

deal. Yeah. Which we have.

Podcast on as

well. Yeah. We’re going to be doing that one. Very soon.

Then you’re not going to get to the finish

line.

So your NRE your new relationship energy gets

depleted. You know, started off great at the first part of the week. And now it’s just.

Right. And.

Now. It could be different if depending on how you’ve defined your friendship.

Right. Maybe your friends are people you only see

twice a year at the same resort. Every year.

I could see how your NRE would be. Supercharged right. Because you’ve only seen him twice a year.

Maybe you’ve worked throughout the year. Kind of build

up that. Tension. Right. When you

finally get to the resort.

Let’s go.

Ready to go. Yeah. Wait. Right. But

really depends on how often you see that

couple. Yeah. I think it depends a lot on the dynamic with that couple.

I can,

I can picture some of the couples that we’ve hooked up with before kind of having that. Kind of ongoing spark.

But that’s not very often.

That’s not very common to have that like

supercharged.

No, it’s not.

And usually it.

Burns out. It burns too hot, too

quick. And it. Yeah. Fizzles. Or like we said, they get a little bit of a shock. And then they get a little bit of a shock. And then they get a little bit of a shock. And then they get a little bit of a shock. Yeah. Fizzles. Or

like we said, they get out of it. Or they get out of it or something weird happens like.

Oh, so then what happens when your friend zoned?

You come to regard someone solely as a friend.

Despite their sexual interest.

And this is really the

death of a swinging opportunity. Honestly.

Yeah. We’ve had this happen. We’ve had this happen to us. We’ve heard it. From other couples who’ve had this happen. There was a.

Quad plus. Because they had.

A few extras that would kind of rotate through. Yeah.

We had heard from them that. You know, after a while.

It kind of gets a little. Same old. Same shit. Different day. Yeah.

Right. And we’re swingers.

We like novelty. So hence. Right. New. You’re always trying to bring in the new and bringing in the new. Especially if you want friends. Takes time. It takes time to cultivate that. So if you’re looking for.

More sexual experiences.

On a regular basis. DTF might be your jam.

Right. Maybe you consider it.

Absolutely.

Now, some people have said, well, if it gets too comfy, you can always just bring it back. You just need to revive that spark. You could. Play a sex game.

Or, or just talk to them and say, Hey, it’s been a

while since we’ve. We’ve done, you know, Let’s set

a play date. Let’s set up a play date. But not

everybody could do that. Right. Some people feel like once you’ve slipped into that friend zone, it’s just.

Dead. Yeah. It’s hard to jumpstart.

That spark. Again. Yeah.

And, and.

When that

spark that NRE is, is good.

It’s, it’s got that.

Afterburn effect, right? It’s your, your coasting.

Your hormones are lingering and. It increases passion with your primary partner. And then when it’s gone.

Uh,

What’s gone.

Right.

So.

And we definitely found that in, in our early experiences where. These

new kind of.

Really exciting sexual experiences. Would get us pumped up and recharged and it would kind of recharge power batteries.

For. Sometimes weeks or

a month. Oh yeah. At least until the next party. And then we would kick started off again. Go over and over and over again. And it was really good for that to kind of. Have those hormones. From the, from the, from the, from the, from the, from the, from the, from the new relationship. But. Have to be in a new relationship.

Right. And what was great about the orgies was you really didn’t depend on NRE. It was

a different type of. Energy and synergy that was

going on. It was just.

Sexual magnetism. Right.

Right. So we still

had a great time, but we didn’t get, we didn’t have that.

Sparky thing that a lot of people are looking for in order to

hook up.

And. It was just

a situation.

But. Right. Exactly.

you’re, you’re waiting, right? For the stars to align, you’re waiting for that energy. Energy that spark to happen. Sometimes you.

You could wait and wait and wait, and then you don’t pull the trigger. And then it starts to fade.

Right. And.

Maybe your inhibitions are altered because you’ve been drinking or doing whatever. And the first time is great, but the next time. You meet up your sober and now.

The sparks not there. As interesting as they were the last time. Right. As funny as they were.

So this whole, I guess the point I’m getting to is this whole focus on. Finding that spark that those people with that NRE energy, that’s what it’s going to take for me to, you

know, fuck you.

That’s pretty

rare.

Yeah.

And I think.

We’ve definitely found that it’s. More situation that creates that spark. Yes. Yes. The individual people. And that’s not to say that the people weren’t sexy or that they weren’t interesting. It’s just that being in

a charge situation where.

People are

horny.

And a lot of people that are horny in a small space makes for a lot of fun

energy. Exactly.

So we want to know what your thoughts are on DTF. FWB and the friend zone couples. Do you think they hide behind definitions? Yeah. I think we should just wrap this up. Yeah. I think we should just wrap this up. Yeah. So. We’re going to end it behind definitions.

Like FWB and friend

zone because they’re afraid of labeling themselves as DTF.

Do you see value? In DTF. We hope we inspired some interesting thoughts

and perspectives with

DSTIGMITIZE DTF and the community

and really encourage you to type in your comments.

maybe if DTF kind of sits uncomfortably with you

and you’re not full on DTF and you still need a little bit of that connection, maybe you’re a hybrid model.

Maybe you’re somewhere in between the two. And I think that that’s

where probably most of us are. We’ve talked about sexuality being very fluid. It’s a spectrum.

I think that this balance between having friendships and being open for any kind of sexual experience or

open to sexual experiences allows us

to kind of have some fluidity between those two definitions. And I think this is one of the reasons why definitions are sometimes shied away from by a lot of people because if you label yourself, does that mean that

that’s the only way that you define yourself

or is there some nuance there or some subtlety? Right. And I think that there’s a lot of nuance and

subtlety between DTF and friends with benefits

because I think we fit somewhere somewhere in the middle between those two. Yeah. And depending on the situation, we’re a little bit more one or the other.

Yeah. Yeah. It highly depends on the situation.

Yeah, absolutely.

Thanks for tuning in. We appreciate you joining our community and hanging out with us.

Don’t forget your homework. Tell a friend about our show. And if you like, leave a review and a comment. You can also leave us a voicemail

at 916-538-0482.

We’d love to hear your comments. We’d love to hear your voices. And if you have a great story about DTF or friends with benefits that you’d like to share with us, feel free to leave us a message. We’ll even use you in the show. If you want to be anonymous, no problem.

If you want to tell everybody your screen name,

go for that too. We’re open to that. You can also reach us at swingeryuniversity.com. We have a website. We’ve got a newsletter. We’ve got all kinds of fun, informative content, sexy content on that site. You can find all of the different social media platforms that we’re on

there.

And as we like to say,

keep learning, keep growing, and keep it sexy.