30 Days in a Cage – The LOCKtober Challenge

Have you ever wanted to lock your in a cage and not masturbate or have sex for an entire month? I am sure most of you would not agree to this self-initiated challenge. However, are you aware of the benefits?

Welcome to Swinger University. I’m Phoebe. And I’m Ed. Join us as we explore the exciting world of ethical, non-monogamy, sexual health and sex education with an intellectual and sexy twist. What is L’October?

It is typically a male-initiated kink. It is a one-month of volunteered abstinence and it is a male chastity device. Now, when I say typically male-initiated, what other forms would it not be? It could also be imposed by a Dom in a Dom sub-relationship. Well, it’s L’October and this is what we’re doing this year. Time to put it away. And you may not know if it’s going to be for two weeks, a day or 30 days. Right. The purpose of L’October is to reset that sexual appetite to maybe gain better understanding of your body and what you want from sex. It can also be very rewarding. We are going to interview one of our favorite guests and he has actually participated in L’October for the full 30 days. In fact, I think it’s even been longer than 30 days.

And so we are going to introduce him now. He’s going to go by Mr. Red. He is the author of many erotic stories at Red Hot Red Erotica. If you haven’t been to him website, you absolutely should go and read some of these fabulous, sexy stories. In fact, we read some of those for our patrons. So if you want to hear them, please go and check those out. He has been in a long term marriage with Ms. Red. My first question to Mr. Red is going to be, how many years have you been doing this? Well, first of all, I’d like to say big thanks to you guys for having me. Appreciate it. This is a kink that started quite some time ago. I’ve been married a long time and it really wasn’t until the days of Tumblr that I think many of us became aware of many things that we probably had ideas in our head, things that we thought, oh, it’s just me. And it’s not that I was necessarily into the concept of chess. I didn’t know what that was prior to kind of discovering it on Tumblr. Not only am I a switch, but I’m highly kinky. So for me, there’s this kind of exploration of, huh, I’d like to know more about that. I’d like to try that. For me, a lot of it also gets into the mental aspects. There’s physical challenge with a lot of kinks. And then there’s also obviously the mental challenge. I first came across a couple of blogs online that were femdom, kukkledresses. This woman is so over the top. Probably wouldn’t really want to know this person in real life because she is scary.

But the stuff that she was doing to her husband, there was just no denying that it turned to be on endlessly. She’s out being like kind of the quote unquote hot wife and having sex with other guys. She’d lock her husband up and go out on trysts and maybe not even tell him. You know, we talk about ethical non-anogamy where you should be fully communicating with her partner. But you also in kink, you also get into these concepts of sensual non-consent. Right. So for me, that was a big part of it. The kinky side wants some more kind of novelty and more extreme sensation seeking kind of elements. So when I came across this, I kind of brought it up to read. She’s not the kinky one in the relationship. I am. I am more the driver in this stuff. We had ordered a chastity cage, one of those kind of clear plastic ones. And I quickly found that like, oh, those aren’t that great. The lady on this blog used this company. They’re actually custom made chastity devices by a company called Mature Metal. I had this chastity cage and you know, there’s like sizing rings. And so it’s pretty, it’s pretty specific to your, your own anatomy. I had this ordered. We kind of played with that and it was just fun. And she wouldn’t tell me she might be going away on a business trip and she’d say, I’m going to lock you up. That perspective I just loved like that, you know, the not knowing. Right. Some are going to love that dynamic of being told what to do and being surprised with stuff. For me, that’s kind of a big, big part of it. So we just started with, I would call it a late chastity, being locked up for a couple of days. And really wasn’t until I became more aware of this locked tober where it was like, okay, now that’s a priest.

Right.

I’m really sexual. I mean, most guys are, but I can get off three or four times a day, like every day. So the thought of being locked up, your reaction to it would be like, no, no effing way. There was no way I could do that. And I think that was also part of the appeal for me is this, I’m a person that like, I like challenge. I’m like, huh, that seems really hard. I’d like to try that. Yes.

It just kind of started like that. We got into it and there was certainly challenges through it. A week into it, you really start to notice behavioral changes, meaning Red and I have a great relationship. We’re attentive to each other, but you definitely notice, oh, she’s in control. And so suddenly you’d find yourself doing more things for her. It’s really hard to explain. You have to experience it. And I don’t know if it is a chemical process that happens in the brain or if it’s just, well, this person’s in control, so I better be on my best behavior. I can’t really describe what that is, but there is a hundred percent, a mental aspect of it that kind of starts to take hold. After a few days, you might be like, oh, you know, I really want to get off. But then after a week or so, I don’t know how to explain it. Other than you, you get into it and you’re like, I can do this. Like anything else that you challenge yourself, whether it’s fitness or any kind of other challenges in life, there’s personalities that just gravitate towards that. So for me, it’s kind of an easy thing to jump into. Interesting. So how did this initial conversation go with your wife? The way that I brought it up, we’re new to the “lifestyle.” Right? A lot of this stuff that we do now was instigated by me, so to speak. I more have the watering for it. This started about, oh, good ten years ago. So prior to the chastity where I started to kind of express myself more sexually about certain desires, and a lot of stuff that I did that, you know, most wives in a vanilla relationship be like, you want to do what? Right.

And so it was really those conversations and kind of almost, I’m going to call it coming out. If we’re not homosexual, we can’t really necessarily relate to what it’s like to “come out.” But in my mind, these sexual things are like coming out. Right. I hope that’s not offensive to anybody. But there’s things that you’ve bottled up that are part of you, that you haven’t shared with people, that you then want to express with a loved one. Someone you deeply trust. And so many deeply trust. And it was that time it was challenging. But I had a lot of these internal conversations and then finally said, OK, I’m going to have these conversations with her. So that kind of opened up the bag of kinks, so to speak.

And it really wasn’t until a few years later that I came across the chastity thing. And so by then, because our level of communication had increased, we were talking about different things and trying different things, it was kind of easy to have the conversation. How does she like it? Was it a progression for her? Initially, was she just, yeah, let’s try it. But then each year as it goes by, she was getting more and more into it. How did her experience change? But she was. Why would anybody want to do that? And it was, of course, kind of the reaction, right? I did have a book that I read, Mel Chastee of Keyholders Guide, was the title of it. A lot of things in there made sense to me and were intuitive. Like a lot of things, if you’re challenged to express yourself a certain way, sometimes it’s really easy to listen to something or read something that is the topic of what you’re interested in and have your mate read that or listen to it with you. That makes it a lot easier to talk about. I’m sure a lot of your fans would knowledge that with your podcast with like, hey, honey, let’s listen to this. Swinger University, because you’re talking about the saying that I find interesting. And then suddenly it’s an easier conversation. The Tumblr blog, which I shared with Red, there’s a lot of stuff in there that gave us different ideas and so forth. And the book helped with kind of understanding. So she kind of was like, you know, had a little some ahas. But again, if you’re not a kinky person, it’s going to be a progression, you know, as you pointed out. Right. Right. And I think over time, as we just did different things and you kind of, you know, things become more, quote unquote, normalized,

and it became easy. And then she kind of did lean into it and found it easier to kind of take a bit of a dom roll doing stuff that she wouldn’t necessarily do. What does she get out of it? Does did she find or discover that it felt really good stepping into an area of control that maybe she had never felt before? Or did it change her in some way? I think not as much changing her as developing a deeper understanding. I think that, you know, it’s not like she reveled in the different things, but when when she would see certain reactions, that would make her more interested. Right. Right. So let’s just jump into some of the things that we might have experienced where I don’t know where this initiative, something that I brought up or just something that she did. And I don’t know what the name for it is other than getting urinated on, you know, get pissed off. Right. Right. So people like water sports. So one morning we get up and she tells me go to the shower and sit down and I’m like, huh, OK, the shower sit down. She comes in and she goes, do not turn the water on. So I sit down and I’m in the shower. Water is not on. She gets in with me and she proceeds to pee all over me. Wow.

And if for those who are kind of into this stuff, like they will connect with this. But that like there’s certain things that can happen. And if you have a submissive tendencies as she starts to pee on me, I start going into subspace. And I don’t know how to describe subspace other than I don’t know if it’s a loss of mental capacity, but you’re just like a deep meditation. Yes, you are going to a different place. There are no words or thoughts. You’re not thinking about the grocery list or anything in your head. You’ve just kind of zoned out. To zone out, you can even not hyperventilating, but almost like short of breath in the moment with something like like you’re so kind of excited by it, you know, short of breath kind of a thing that would happen. And then sort of variety of things like that that she would do when I was locked up one time, she unlocked me and then she gave me a ruined orgasm. I’m also dominant, like I said, I’m a switch. So I enjoy doing that kind of stuff to it to her. Not that we do a lot of that kind of stuff. I love that position of power of like making her do something or doing something that’s a little over the top or a little humiliating. And I enjoy having that done to me also. Right. I think with Chesedee, it’s not she can’t just lock you up and say, OK, you’re locked up for the month and then you’re going to buy your daily business work and go to the grocery store. And like that’s going to get boring. You do have to have a partner who understands the dynamic and wants to kind of ratchet up the level of what you’re experiencing for the period of time.

So let’s talk about some of that stuff, because it sounds like we’re moving into how it challenges you for that month. The mental and that and that some of that physical. Yeah. So what are some of those those mental barriers or those those things that kind of force you to consider your position and what’s going on?

Well, it’s really funny, but I can’t remember if this is a couple of years ago now. I was pretty randy one morning. That’s very selfless act of like, OK, I’m not going to come, but we’re having sex and I’m going to go down on her, give her orgasm. That’s really fulfilling. And then just ending it with kind of sponing with her or whatever and falling asleep or whatever time of the day it is.

I find it to be just extremely satisfying so you can be giving and you’re caged. So your dick is not a part of the conversation. Right. Right. So it just becomes this this power shift where your your pleasure comes from pleasing the other partner. That can also extend to just daily things like you guys have been married for a long time. So you probably encounter situations where you’re kind of stressed. You divide up your your duties like, OK, I’m going to do the X, Y and Z. You’re going to be a B and C kind of divide and conquer.

And we’ve all been there where something that you’re responsible for is taking an inordinate amount of your time or whatever. And so you start to feel a little maybe not resentful, but just like, God, I’m putting in a lot here. When you’re in chastity, it’s kind of weird that some of those elements just kind of go away. I don’t know, again, what that is other than it’s got to be a chemical thing going on in the brain where you’re just a little more open to taking care of certain things that maybe you normally wouldn’t or she would take care of. You’re just kind of a yes, ma’am. There’s no argument. There’s no discussion. It’s like, of course, I’ll take care of that. It’s like an attitude adjustment almost. Interesting. Interesting. I guess one of the other questions that I have is, have you had moments where you had to kind of will yourself through the process? In other words, mental challenges to kind of keep going or stay with it?

Yes, kind of like I mentioned, for me, the only part where it can be challenging is if you’re caught up in daily life and we’re both professionals, she’s pretty busy with her, the business that she does. She does a certain amount of travel. So if she’s like all business and I think guys are always thinking about sex and I think if women are busy or tasked with things, it might be one of the last things on their mind. So certainly, if you’re not feeling sexual, you’re not really thinking about what I need to be doing to torture my partner. Right.

So that is the challenge is if days are going by, week goes by and you’re so ingrained in daily life, a big part of the whole Chastity thing is the kind of sub-dom aspects and the submissive most. And so some of the things that we’ve been being new to the lifestyle.

I’m way more open to this than Retta’s, where I would love her to just like be out on a business trip and just like pick up some guy, have sex, like not telling. Tell me like a month, a couple of weeks or a month later, like make it kind of intense, like a little more mean kind of means not the right word. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I don’t have a say in the matter. Right. And I think that is a part of the submissiveness is you don’t have a say in the matter and I’m going to do what I’m going to do. Those elements, I would be like, oh, that hasn’t happened. But that would be like an ultimate goal for me is if something like that, that would keep me keenly focused on the Chastity aspect. So that is probably the biggest thing is if things are boring, then it’s kind of like, yeah, this is just I’m thinking through this and kind of picturing it. And you have a daily reminder that there’s something sexual going on or completely non-sexual because you’ve been locked up.

But it’s there and it’s tugging at your psyche, so to speak.

And she doesn’t have that. So in a sense, you’ve got this perpetual reminder of what’s going on. And so she’s kind of disconnected from that. That would be a really big challenge for me is that I’m, you know, it’s almost like someone’s tugging at my ear, my yeah, teasing me all the time. Yeah. Yeah. And it makes it almost omnipresent in your mind that something’s going on.

Yes. And that’s very true because men’s genitalia is on the outside. And so we’re always aware of it. And it’s like even from a young age, this reputation of like touching ourselves, whether it’s baseball players or children or guys or, you know, we’re always reaching out and grabbing. It’s there. And it’s like, look, if you had something in between your legs, you’d grab it too. Right. Right. So, yeah, you’re always aware of it. And then you add the weight. So the Chastity cage that I’m wearing is, you know, it’s metal. It’s like surgical steel. So it has more weight to it. So then, yeah, you’re always even more aware because you can you could feel it. So it does kind of heighten like you’re saying. There’s always that constant reminder, constant tease kind of going on. Yeah. Interesting. Well, this is a good transition to kind of the next topic, which is some of the physical aspects of it. And it’s it’s interesting because you’re talking about the weight and I’m reminded of the Prince Albert jewelry. And with the large gauge ring that I have, you know, when it’s kind of just floating around bobbing, like I really do feel the weight of it. It’s it’s there and it’s this constant reminder or at least this occasional reminder of what’s going on. But it’s nowhere near as heavy as like a Chastity cage. I mean, that’s a lot more metal. So so let’s talk about that for a second.

You have a large metal cage wrapped around everything, your whole package.

Is there any pain involved with that?

I have done this for a total of in the since 2015, when we first started, I think it’s been a total of 245 days. Wow. She locked me up yesterday, October 1st. Yeah. So I’m kind of assuming she’s going to keep me locked for 31 days.

But I don’t know. You know, it’s not up to me. It’s up to her. And the longest I’ve gone has been 35 days. It’s kind of funny because once you get towards the end and it does remember that episode of Seinfeld where they were in the rental car and the rental car didn’t have much gas left in it and they kept driving and driving and they’re like, we’re seeing how far they can go before eventually ran out of gas. That’s what it’s like. You’re like days are going by and you’re like, I can do this another day. I could do this one more day. Like you’re just it’s a mental, you know, totally this mental thing. There are things that you need to be careful of, you know, every time you take a shower, paying attention to washing the cage, sticking your fingers into the crevices to kind of wash it and so forth. I use grape seed oil. And this is a big thing. If you just put on the cage and you’re wearing it for a period of time, you know, you’re definitely going to get chafing. It’s going to be pulling certain types of clothing. We might be more uncomfortable. Wow. Having some support is actually helpful. So you might think, oh, just throw on a pair of shorts or something with no underwear. It’s probably going to be more comfortable to put some underwear on because it’s going to hold the cage a little better. It’s going to be more comfortable. Right. Everybody always talks about coconut oil, but, you know, to me, grape seed oil is a better alternative for many things because it’s less viscous. So it’s not doesn’t have that greasy factor. It absorbs in your skin really easily. So it’s a lighter thing and it’s, you know, grape seed oil is like any other oil. You can eat it, you know, basically. So it’s really safe for your body, for your skin. Nice.

So you put that around the ring, the base ring that goes around both cock and balls. It’s mostly your testicles, your scrotum that you want to have lubrication on because the skin can get shaved. The biggest thing is if you’re getting an erection, people think of like having your dick in this cage is going to be uncomfortable and that is not the uncomfortable part. Interesting. Having your penis like get erect in the cage and you can see your penis is almost like bursting out of the cage.

That is not, I mean, it’s not that that’s comfortable, but it’s not the uncomfortable part. The uncomfortable part is that is a set size and as your penis is growing, it’s pushing the entire thing forward. Right. And so that that base ring is behind your testicles.

And so it’s now it’s going to be putting pressure on kind of that around the perineum. So from the perineum to where your testicles are, that is going to get like stretched and that becomes painful, downright painful. So when you start getting an erection, you’re like, okay, we need to stop this right now because that is sore. So I’ve done things as extreme as and I like no doctor would recommend this, but I actually put on a numbing cream. You know, when I did get like some soreness in that area, I used a numbing cream.

Little a little tip here that would some people may find disappointing, but the most that I’ve gone without having any relief getting out of the chest and cage has been probably about two to three weeks. And what becomes a problem, it’s not the pain as much as the lack of sleep because when you are getting nocturnal erections, you cannot control. Right, right. There’s nothing you can take and there’s nothing you can do to change nocturnal erections. It’s part of your body and any healthy male should be having nocturnal erections. You are going to wake up with a raging hard on and you’re going to holy shit. My balls are on fire. Wow.

Yeah, because if you lay in bed, like you’re you could wake you up, but you might be that, you know, how that sleepiness like you’re like, oh, you just lay there like you don’t want to get out of bed because you’re tired.

If you just lay there, that erection is not going to go away. Most guys know what I’m talking about, sleepy penis, like you have a meal and you lay down, you like a sit down slush down on the sofa. Like that’s a great time to get sleepy penis and as long as you’re in the position, you know, you’re going to have an erection. So you need to be like up so that what I found was, okay, I got to go to the eventually you can go to the bathroom, right? Because you want to go pee and you’re going to have to stand like literally stand up for whatever five minutes until the erection goes down. But then it will get to the point where you go, you go to bed and then it could be, I don’t know, 10 minutes later that maybe the Russian comes back. So it really will impair your sleep and that is probably the thing. It’s like, well, you can’t go that many days with having, you know, your sleep disrupted. Yeah. So what you can do, and this is kind of the scout sound of thing because there’s no chassis cage is going to contain any any cock. The penis is so when it’s completely flaccid, you can push the penis into the body. Right. You know, right. And so you can just push that in and it comes out the top of the base ring. Now, the cage is still going to be locked on your testicles. So you can’t get the cage off, but your penis is out. So then people would say, well, wait a second. Then you’re cheating. All I can say is whenever she puts me in that cage, there’s no cheating going on. I am not going to masturbate regardless. And I never I never have since very, very much a mental thing and a submissive thing. Like she told me to do this and I am doing it. I do find that like at night when you go to bed, you can do that little pull out and then you’re not going to have the disruption of the sleep because there’s really no way around the disruption of sleep. Yeah. Yeah. That thing that thing is on there for 30 days, but there’s a little work around there. Now for people who are really extreme and I have one of these, but I haven’t worn it for any real length of time. They have a sounding like a catheter three inches to four inches long that goes right into the penis down the urethra and it screws onto the end of the chest. Caged. Wow. So I think that it would be really hard to pull your penis out of that. Right. But that one freaks Jenna out. That’s another topic, but the sounding when we went to see a prodom a few years ago, we got into some ass play and the prodom pulled out these sounding things and she was like, oh, we can use these. And Jen was like, covered her eyes. She’s like, no. And I was like, well, I don’t think I’m, I don’t think I’m ready for that, but that did plant the seed in my mind. So later on being the kinky perverted guy that I am, I’m like, huh, I wonder what that’s all about. I want to try that. So I actually have tried the sounding and so then this this chassis cage has urethral plug, I think is what they call it on it. But I have not worn that long, long periods of time.

Fascinating. I’m so fascinated by this. Okay, so then you do, you can take your penis out of the cage for some periods of time during the 30 days or whenever you want to, right, to give a little relief. But then you you put it back in that the sleep aspect makes sense.

What about when you’re showering? You don’t really need to because you’re you just are diligent when you’re cleaning, right? Exactly. Yeah. And then how is peeing through the cage? Is that messy? You know, I have no problem if you’re if you’re your urethra, your pee hole is not lined up with the opening in the cage. Obviously, it could be messy. It could splash. Right. I have to have some experience with it. You get to know things pretty well and you have to get a cage that fits appropriately. It can’t be loose like some I’ve seen like in some of the, you know, social media, I’ve seen guys in there. It’s like too loose like no, it has to be relatively snug like fit and it’ll stay in place better. And and then I can actually pee standing up. But honestly, like at night when I go to the bathroom, I sit down anyway, because who wants to try on a light in the middle of the night? Look to see where the pain you just sit down. So generally sitting down is a lot easier. I don’t have any issues with that. There’s no problem. Nice. Have you ever heard of any of the muscles being weakened or shrunk? There’s some narrative out there that that can happen. But can it really over a period of a few weeks? I do think that you’ll see because if you’re not getting sexual stimulation, where you have a prolonged, you know, erection, erectile tissue, the more that you use it and especially if you edge and know how to really maximize your erectile tissue while you’re having sex that does keep it that tissue kind of at its peak, so to speak. Size wise. I do think that you’ll see whatever you want to call it, shrinkage or or whatever. But that’s that’s going to go as soon as you have sex. That’s going to go away.

There’s nothing there that would be like, oh, you’re permanently going to, you know, be smaller or anything like that. Just like, no, that’s not a thing.

Fascinating. I was so fascinated. I love knowing about all the kinks and all the things that everyone really enjoys for their own pleasure.

We talked a little bit about the power dynamics.

We talked a little bit about how this enhances, you know, the sexual participation. Your focus gets changed 100% to Ms. Red, and so then she gets your your full attention and that in turn gives you pleasure.

And are there other types of pleasure that you can participate in together while you’re caged?

Or is it are you just 100% off the table with all sexual activity?

No, not not at all. And then you can get into pegging, right? So, you know, and I love anal play. So that’s something that we experienced with the prodom some years ago. And I enjoy that very much. I enjoy doing it to her and try her to bring it to me. When we do have an occasion, she does enjoy it because, you know, at first, I think a typical woman is going to respond to pegging like, why would I want to do that? What’s in it for me? And then when they do it and they hear the guy moaning and like, oh, oh, that feels good, you know, and all that reaction and it’s something they’re doing, you know, they’re thrusting and that’s happening. It’s like, oh, that’s a different experience. And so there is she does enjoy that. It’s giving her, you know, some power that’s not typical for the female experience.

And it’s it’s really enjoyable. And that is one of the things that I like, but that, you know, that prostate orgasm while being penetrated has been elusive. I haven’t experienced it yet.

Interesting, fascinating.

I like so wait, then when you’re stimulating the prostate, you don’t get an erection. And if you start to get one, is it? I mean, does that basically just do you have to stop because it starts pulling?

No, it’s it’s really hard to explain. It’s it’s like once you become first with chest, you can kind of, you know, kind of where your body’s at. So like when you’re focusing on that, you’re just going to focus on your ass. You’re just going to focus on that area of your body. You’re not going to focus on the penis, which, you know, is not natural for, you know, we’re so you had males were so used to stimulating that part of her body. And having that part of her body involved. But because you don’t want to get an erection, you will get aroused. You’re going to get some level of arousal and erection, but it’s not going to be, you know, it’s not going to be the point of like, oh, you know, I’m ready to penetrate. Right. It’s not going to be that level of arousal.

So, you know, I think with prostate play, you’re definitely going to be there’s going to be some level of arousal, but not not like when, you know, the male is doing the penetration. Oh, OK. OK. Because I was dying to know that part because I thought that you’re going, you’re going and then you’re like, stop, stop, stop.

No, not quite.

Interesting. So it sounds like then to kind of bring it back to earlier when you were talking that that it’s that sleep deprivation because you you know, that that that pain part where you’re you’re getting the nightly would or the morning would. Where you’re not being able to sleep because of that that pressure that involuntary pressure in the.

Right. That’s the biggest challenge with chastity, honestly, is the nocturnal erections. Interesting. Other than that, it’s easy peasy.

I should send you this link. So one of my favorite one of my favorite content creators is Venus Koppel. I love her podcast. I listened to the one on this past weekend and she had a a link in there to a talk that Dan Savage gave. That was about it was a YouTube talk. Maybe you guys have seen it. It was five years ago and it’s phenomenal.

It’s on kind of our in our realm of sexuality and, you know, sex conversations.

I don’t know that there’s anything specifically to say like to the community. The one thing that I would say is you guys know me pretty well and I don’t have.

You know, it’s not that I’m shameless, but I don’t really have much in way of shame. It’s like I am who I am. I’m going to present that. I’m going to talk about the things I’m interested in. I have no shame around talking about how I like getting fucked in the ass or stuff like that. And I do think for men, you know, so I identify as a cis hetero male.

What do they call it? Hetero flexible. But then you get into these other elements of like, well, on the submissive side, well, what if Jen, you know, tied me up and we’re like, we’re at a sex party and like whoever wanted to could fuck me. Like I’d be I’d actually be down for that. Like I could do that. So I think then you get in. So with a lot of things, so the only thing that and I’m not it’s not like it’s not a hot button for me, but I do see this where men are really challenged to talk about certain sexual things because they think it might be perceived as gay or if a woman hears me saying this, I’m going to be judged and I’m in the swimmer community and I want to be having sex with women. So I don’t want to be judged that way. And I do think that there’s a lot of guys out there like super masculine guys, you know, that would be down for all kinds of things, but they will. 100% are not going to admit that or talk about it because there’s shame there or they’re embarrassed about it. So I don’t know that that’s a topic to really conclude with, but, you know, maybe there’s a nice way of saying simply that, you know, if you’re if you’re in the community and into this like own it. You know, it’s like there’s this is something that’s really fun for you women out there who have partners that may be interested in it. You know, just listen with open ears and an open heart if if they have an interest, if your partner has an interest in stuff like this.

Because, you know, as with partners, we owe that to each other, right, to listen and to be open.

So, you know, you might on your sexual interest got the Venn diagram, you got that little bit of overlap where you’re kind of exploring and it’s like if you have a committed partner, you got to be interested in kind of pushing pushing your boundaries so that you get a little more overlap on that Venn diagram. Right. If you’re a switch, be proud of like exploring this stuff and don’t let what other people think, you know, stop you from exploration.

Well, thank you so much for sharing your experiences with LOCKtober and the challenges and maybe some of our listeners will consider this as an opportunity to explore a little bit in in areas that they’d never thought to to try.

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