20 Ways To Blow Up Your Swing Game

[00:04] [Guest] Welcome to Swinger University, your horizontal enrichment program, a new kind of accelerated
learning program.

[00:15] [Unknown] Here are your hosts, Ed and Phoebe.

[00:22] [Ed] This is Ed.

[00:23] [Unknown] And this is Phoebe.
Today we’re talking about the things you may do that jeopardize your chances at a

[00:31] [Ed] Swinger experience.
Going to list 20 items pertaining to physical attributes, personality, networking, teamwork,
sensitive topics, anticipation, and kinks.

[00:47] [Phoebe] Item number one, Swinger sites.
Join the correct site prayer area, pay the fee, and you’ll get emails.
We’ve talked about this before in one of our early episodes on how to get connected

[01:03] [Unknown] with parties, hot dates, events, and a couple of dates in your community.

[01:10] [Ed] So check out the Swinger apps that are in your area and it’s hard to know exactly which
one is your area until you try a couple out and see how many people are there.
So do a search, see how many Swingers come back in your city and that’ll help you decide
which app best meets your needs.

[01:29] [Phoebe] We just acquired a new listener to our podcast who lives in our city that didn’t even know
about the hotel takeovers we go to three to four times a year.

[01:42] [Unknown] Right.

[01:43] [Phoebe] And they’ve been swinging for a while.
So maybe they’re a little new, I don’t know, but I don’t know how they missed it.
So we quickly turned them on to that.

[01:51] [Ed] Yeah.
So get the word out like we said, because there are Swingers who are missing out on all the
fun.

[01:59] [Unknown] Right.

[02:00] [Phoebe] Number two, physical appearance, update your wardrobe.

[02:04] [Unknown] I’ve done it several times.

[02:08] [Phoebe] And the longer I swing, the more as Ed would say slutty, my clothing kids, I call it

[02:17] [Ed] just flaunting what she’s already had all the time.
She’s flaunting what she’s got more than she used to.

[02:24] [Phoebe] It’s amazing how comfortable you start to get when you start running around naked all

[02:27] [Unknown] a time.

[02:28] [Ed] I’m very comfortable with you running around naked, I appreciate it.

[02:34] [Phoebe] A lot of people step up their fitness as well.
It gives you more confidence, it generates more testosterone, you generally just feel
better.
Your goal isn’t to lose weight or tone up, that physical activity is going to make you
feel confident.
It does something for you.

[02:55] [Unknown] If anything, it helps with your stamina to stay late at parties or fuck longer or fuck

[03:02] [Ed] longer.
And just as a note too, I didn’t say it when Phoebe had mentioned updating wardrobe,
but guys, this applies to you as well.
Put the jeans and the t-shirt back in the drawer, that’s great for going to hang in
and out at the bar with your buddies.
Not so much for swinging.

[03:19] [Unknown] Yeah.

[03:20] [Ed] Dress to impress.
I agree.
Put a little effort in.

[03:23] [Phoebe] I agree.
Hi, Jean.
Obviously, some of this is obvious, right?
Everyone shower ahead of time, freshen up if you’ve had a long drive or you feel like
you’re sweating while dancing.
We always, when we get to the hotel, we, even though I shower that morning, I freshen
up again before I go to the dance floor, and I use a product, I’m going to do a product
review on this product called Loom.

[03:50] [Unknown] It’s basically like a, oh, what is it?

[03:55] [Phoebe] What’s the word?
Baking soda?
No, I can’t remember what it’s made of now.
It’s like a very natural deodorant, keeps you smelling fresh.
The one when you’re sweating, all the dance floor and stuff, you don’t stink.
That’s really, really nice.
Obviously, brush your teeth.
Use the mouthwash.
If you don’t, if you’re not a mouthwash user, use it anyway.
Get the little breath mints.
Make sure you’re deodorant, it’s great.
If you’re a deodorant user and not an anti-persperant user, switch to anti-persperant
that night because you’re going to probably need a little extra protection.
So easy on your colon and perfume, because I can’t tell you how many times I run into
people with too much of it, and it’s just stuck on me, and I can’t get it off.

[04:43] [Unknown] It’s like everywhere, and it’s, it’ll actually kind of turn your stomach, too, if it’s a little

[04:48] [Ed] too strong.
It’s just such a strong scent.

[04:53] [Unknown] Right.

[04:54] [Phoebe] Whether you really like it or you don’t like it, it can be overwhelming either way.
There are many, many times I’ve had to just, yeah.

[05:03] [Ed] Yeah.
And of course, wash your hands before you play.

[05:07] [Unknown] Right.

[05:08] [Ed] You would wash your hands before you stuck anything in your mouth.
Why wouldn’t you wash your hands before you stuck your fingers in somebody else?

[05:14] [Unknown] Thank you, Ed.

[05:17] [Phoebe] Perfection.
It does not exist.

[05:20] [Ed] Don’t hold out for perfection, but you can strive for perfection if you want.

[05:25] [Unknown] Right.

[05:26] [Phoebe] Oh, by the way, that was a number four perfection.
Most people don’t care, and they don’t even notice.
In fact, Ed saw this great video the other day.
Was it a video, or was it another podcaster, and he was talking about what men think about
when they’re with a woman?

[05:46] [Ed] Yeah.
It was a video, and I can’t remember what the context of it was.
I think it was a swing or podcast, and it was a clip that they’d grabbed from it.
But basically, the guy, I wish I’d written it down or saved it, but it was basically women
stop listening to yourselves, listen to the men, and it was basically like, get your
finesse over here and let me do things to you, because I love it.
Yeah.
I love the way you look, whether you’re skinny or tall or short or fat, whatever, it
don’t matter.
Get your finesse over here.

[06:23] [Phoebe] Yeah.
I know.

[06:25] [Ed] He was so great.
It was awesome.

[06:27] [Phoebe] He’s like, the thighs, the butt, the arms, the face, all of it.
We don’t think about what’s missing, what’s wrong, what’s got a dimple, what’s got a
curve, you know, what’s got a wrinkle, and he’s like, we don’t look at that.
We don’t see.
Oh, we see a sexy.
So just get over here and start having some fun.
And I just loved it.
I just loved it.
So it’s very true.
We’re actually live by.

[06:49] [Unknown] Yes.

[06:50] [Phoebe] So let’s see.
Yeah.

[06:52] [Ed] And what that comes down to is confidence is sexy.

[06:55] [Phoebe] Correct.

[06:56] [Unknown] If you stop worrying about how you look and you just start worrying about having a good
time and exuding confidence, even if you have to fake it till you make it, you will

[07:10] [Ed] be sexier.

[07:11] [Unknown] Yes.

[07:12] [Phoebe] And now I think we’re on number five and I’m going to tell you, I’m going to probably
lose count as we go.
So another perfection, don’t as far as like income and education, et cetera, right?

[07:26] [Unknown] Don’t actively try to date up or match up.

[07:30] [Phoebe] I mean, don’t make that your main focus.
If you want to, I absolutely do it.
If you want to approach a couple that you think might be a little out of your league,
absolutely go for it.
Absolutely.
Don’t let that hold you back, but, but, but don’t, don’t make that like your, your
only limit, right?
Don’t limit yourself as basically what I’m trying to say.
Right.
And you’re not looking for that ultimate couple.
You’re looking for a bond, you’re looking for casual, sexy time.

[08:02] [Ed] Yeah.
Yeah.
This isn’t a life partner, folks.

[08:05] [Unknown] This is a, for the next couple of hours partner, but, but sometimes these individuals

[08:13] [Phoebe] become really good friends, even lifetime friends or friends for several years.
You don’t play them with them for several years because you, you, you’ve stuck them in
the friend zone.
And then one weekend you decide to go away and have a good time.
Don’t have any expectations, but you bring your backup, hobag, just in case, like a good
swinger does.
And you never know, you might just get really lucky with people that were stuck in the
friend zone.
Right.

[08:45] [Ed] Right?
Sometimes that you’ve had for a long time and next thing, you know, you, everybody’s naked
and fucking, fucking right there in the middle of the car.

[08:54] [Phoebe] It happens.
It does.
I’m telling you.

[08:57] [Ed] It has happened.

[08:58] [Phoebe] Yes.
Age.
Age is just a number.
I think we’re on number six.
Yes.
Try not to think of them as old as your kids.
If they’re more younger than you, don’t try not to think about that because we have thought
those thoughts before.
And yet we have slept with some young people and we were like, oh my god, that was so

[09:20] [Unknown] fun.

[09:21] [Ed] And honestly, you don’t really know their age.
No.
You’re not checking their, their.
You don’t.

[09:26] [Phoebe] So they could just have really good genes and they just look really young.

[09:31] [Ed] So stop assuming that they’re the same age as your kids or that they’re the same age
as your parents for that matter.

[09:37] [Unknown] Right.

[09:38] [Ed] And just have a good time.
They’re fun, interesting people.
They’re consenting adults, period.
Just leave it at that.

[09:45] [Phoebe] Right.

[09:46] [Unknown] Right.

[09:47] [Phoebe] Back to what you said earlier, you’re not looking for a lifetime relationship, you’re looking
for two hours of fun.

[09:52] [Unknown] Yeah.
And you know, you talk about things that are just across the board, fun and sexy, places
you’ve gone, great foods you’ve tried, maybe sports if you’re into sports, but keep
it fun and sexy.

[10:16] [Ed] We need your help so that your community, the very one you love and have so much fun with
can also find our show.
Here’s a really easy way to do that.
If you’re listening on Apple podcasts or Spotify, hit that follow button and leave us

[10:33] [Unknown] a rating.

[10:34] [Ed] If you’re watching on YouTube, subscribe and turn on notifications.
We can’t emphasize enough how much this helps the Swinger community.
And it truly is up to you to make that happen.
It makes a massive difference in whether new listeners can even find us.
And here’s the thing, when someone searches Swinger podcast, the algorithm doesn’t care
how good our content is or how long we’ve been around.
It only cares about ratings and reviews.
We’d appreciate it and your community will really appreciate it.

[11:11] [Unknown] Thanks for listening.

[11:16] [Phoebe] Teamwork, being on the same page with your partner is really important.
We would always have this play review if you want to put it on the sports theme.
How you feeling on that?
Where you at?
You’re nervous?
What’s your trigger?
Do you think?
Are you feeling good?
Are you feeling excited?
Are you feeling what?
And so we always check in before we check in once we get there.

[11:45] [Ed] Yeah.
Because if you’re not on the same page, just like the Velociraptor’s Consense.
Yes.
Yes.
Other Swinger’s Consense, people not being on the same page and being kind of out of
tune with each other.
It’s kind of a weird thing, but you go.
He’s excited.
She’s checking her watch or looking around, doing something.
You start to pick up on those non-verbal signals.
It’s just, it’s kind of off-putting.
Because you’re like, is it my breath?
Or is she just not into this?
Like, what’s going on?

[12:25] [Phoebe] I don’t understand.
And you won’t always be on the same page every single time you go to a event.
There’s plenty of times that we’ve not been on the same page.
I’m just not feeling it that night.
I tried, you know, and it just didn’t work out, but at least it was a success.
Because we got dressed.
We went out.
We had a date night and we met and talked with really interesting and sexy people and made some
contacts.
Yeah.
Contacts.
So we didn’t maybe get to play that particular night, but it was still a plus.

[13:01] [Ed] And I think part of that too is because we were on the same page.
I mean, some early experiences, we weren’t on the same page and we figured that out pretty quickly
when we got ourselves into trouble.
But now that we’re really on the same page and we know how to get on the same page,
we don’t set the other couple up or couples up for a weird dynamic with us, right?

[13:29] [Guest] Yeah.

[13:30] [Ed] Yeah.
So it’s important.

[13:33] [Unknown] Exactly.

[13:36] [Ed] Have each other’s backs kind of limit the whole inside jokes and sarcasm and things like that.

[13:42] [Guest] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[13:43] [Ed] Are you being a little off-putting?

[13:44] [Guest] Yeah, that’s off-putting.

[13:45] [Ed] You get used to it with your own kind of like marital banter.
Right.
You know, you and your partner find, we’ve seen couples that acted like junior high school kids.
We’re almost like him pushing her and pulling her top down.
And that was his idea of fun.

[14:04] [Unknown] And for us, it was fucking disturbing.

[14:07] [Ed] It was really weird to watch.

[14:09] [Phoebe] Uncomfortable.
I didn’t like it.

[14:11] [Ed] And it was like, yeah.
Okay, you were hot about five seconds ago and now we’re going to go.
We got to, we got someplace else to be.
We got to go.
So yeah.

[14:21] [Phoebe] Same with sarcasm.
Keep it to a minimum.
You know, if you’re a sarcastic type of personality, I get it and don’t, don’t change.

[14:29] [Unknown] But maybe try and keep it to a minimum if others are, it basically comes down to be yourself.

[14:40] [Phoebe] But you are still trying to connect with other people.
So if they’re not getting your joke or your sarcasm, don’t force it upon them.
There are an audience.
You have to read your audience, right?
You’re trying to attract them to your trap.
Totally.
So don’t, don’t offend them.
What?
Modify.

[15:00] [Ed] Modify verbal cues, right?
Yeah.

[15:02] [Phoebe] The body language.

[15:03] [Ed] Right.
If every time you say something, they flinch a little.

[15:06] [Phoebe] Maybe dial it down.
Don’t let it down a little.
Yeah.
Right.
All right.
Flexibility.
Meeting a couple of, you know, different locations.
Maybe halfway between restaurant bar, whatever you, you know, be flexible in that.
at your house, at their house, whatever.
Paying for dinner or drinks,
typically one person would cover,
and then if we met the second time,

[15:32] [Ed] we would cover, or vice versa.
Or even just go Dutch and couples,
splits the check halfway.
We don’t noodle about the subtle differences between,
she had two glasses of wine and we had one.
Nah.
Like, forget the details, just kind of.

[15:51] [Unknown] Yeah.

[15:52] [Phoebe] It kind of, it works out.

[15:55] [Ed] Yeah.
Carmically or the next date, it will work out.

[15:59] [Phoebe] And be flexible with covering the room cost.
We’ve been with people that have already covered
the room cost because they’re, say, they’re downtown.
They’re already downtown for a great night.
And they’re out doing their thing,
and they happen to post a hot day at the same time.
So if the hot date works out, then they have a hotel.
If it doesn’t work out, then they still have a hotel
and they still have each other.
And they had their date.
So typically, if that happens, no one really asks you
to pony up, if they’ve already got the room.
But we have also been in situations where we did say,
hey, would you like to go get a room?
We’ll split the cost.
Right.
So it’s not all depends on how you want to do it.
Just be flexible.

[16:50] [Ed] Interverted wall flowers.

[16:52] [Unknown] Yeah, so you got to get those dark groups of us

[16:55] [Ed] that are kind of in our own shell.

[16:57] [Unknown] And we weren’t, I’m just gonna start that whole thing over.

[17:07] [Ed] Being an introvert or a wall flower,
some of us have worked very hard to come out of our shelves.
And you really force yourself to interact
with other people.
And eventually, it starts to become more and more comfortable.

[17:23] [Phoebe] It’s the whole fake it to make it.
And the more you practice something, the easier it gets
as we all know, it’s true.
It’s true, it’s true, it’s true.
Just pretend you’re acting.
Yeah, this is what gets me by the whole time.

[17:37] [Ed] And there’s some pretty easy techniques for stuff like this.
Talk to at least three couples at an event.
Yep.
Forces you to get up off your seat, walk around the room,
walk up to people.
And eventually that just becomes comfortable.

[17:51] [Phoebe] I can never, ever sit down in an event.
That’s my kryptonite.
If I sit down, we are dead in the water.
Yep.
Nothing happens.
I have to keep moving otherwise.

[18:05] [Ed] You’re like a shark.

[18:06] [Phoebe] I am and I figured that out.
I figured that out.
When we used to go to these, I used to always sit and wait.

[18:15] [Ed] It just sucks the fun right out of the party.

[18:18] [Phoebe] Yeah, you cannot do that.
You absolutely cannot.

[18:23] [Ed] Now, if you’re engaged in a conversation with a couple
and you need to rest your feet, absolutely,
sit down for a little bit.

[18:29] [Unknown] Sure.

[18:30] [Ed] But as soon as the conversation starts to slow down a little bit,
go dance, take it with you, just something.
Yes.
Exactly.
Another really simple technique for getting out of your shell
and compliment people.
You look great, great tie, the shoes are sexy, something.
It’s a conversation starter.

[18:56] [Phoebe] Yes.

[18:57] [Unknown] I would even say, be honest.

[19:00] [Phoebe] Mention that it is your first time that you’re new.
People are really happy to take you under their wing.
And you become instantly real.
Why?
Because you’re revealing something that’s
very honest and kind of raw.

[19:16] [Ed] Kind of intimate.

[19:17] [Phoebe] Kind of intimate.
Like, hey, I’m new.
We’re new in this thing.
And it’s instantaneous how people warm up to you.
Oh my gosh.
And people are so helpful.
And they really want to.

[19:28] [Ed] Because people empathize.

[19:30] [Phoebe] They do.
So you have that instant connection.

[19:34] [Ed] Started out new and was in that exact same situation.
So people get it.
And it’s a really good bonding opportunity.

[19:43] [Phoebe] I agree.
I agree.
Next one.
Hang with the professionals.
I will say, newbies and dabblers can tend to bail on dates.
And you know, you’re just, I get it.
It’s not a negative thing.
Everyone’s just trying to figure it out, right?
And stuff comes up.
They’re nervous.

[20:04] [Unknown] Yeah.

[20:05] [Phoebe] They’re trying to juggle life and all the feelings and things that come along with it.
Our experience wingers are more likely to invite you to a party if you’re soft swap.
It’s an opportunity to learn, watch, and experiment with little to no peer pressure.
So don’t take yourself out of the game just because you’re soft and you’re not full.
People aren’t going to know that.
And honestly, people don’t even ask you that.
Not a lot of people do unless you’re doing a one, you know, a one on one with that
couple, just the you for in their room.
And they happen to be full and that’s their preference.
They will ask you that.
But if it’s a group party, no, no one cares.
There’s something for everybody in a group party.

[20:54] [Ed] Yeah.
And honestly, for the first half of the party, three quarters of the party, it’s mostly
the playtime start.
It’s just social engagement.
You’re just having conversations with people.

[21:04] [Phoebe] So social engagement and it’s usually soft anyway.

[21:07] [Unknown] So.

[21:08] [Phoebe] Yeah.

[21:09] [Ed] So just go for it.
Have a good time.

[21:11] [Phoebe] Yeah.
So target those professionals.
Don’t be intimidated.
I say go for it.
Get yourself in there.

[21:19] [Unknown] Get in that game.

[21:21] [Ed] Can next topic, sensitive topics, these are things that either A, you should avoid completely
or B be very careful and wait for the opportunity for it to be brought up.
Oh, why?

[21:37] [Unknown] But I’m going to say you probably shouldn’t be talking about these things at all.

[21:43] [Phoebe] Oh, God.
Okay.

[21:45] [Ed] What are these things?
Well, the same things you don’t talk to your family about during Thanksgiving.

[21:49] [Phoebe] Oh, okay.

[21:50] [Ed] Politics, religion, not sexy, not in the bedroom or kind of a fun event.
Right.
Nobody wants to hear about these things.
They’re having a good time and you’re, you got a 50-50 chance of offending somebody.

[22:08] [Unknown] Right.

[22:09] [Ed] Right.
For either one of those, maybe higher or lower depending on where you are.

[22:14] [Unknown] Right.

[22:16] [Ed] Even if you know the couple and are very comfortable having these kinds of conversations, the people

[22:23] [Unknown] around you may not be comfortable with the conversation.

[22:29] [Phoebe] So even though you haven’t seen your old buddy and you want to catch up on your local
politics, don’t talk about an event.

[22:37] [Ed] You could be turning everybody around you all of your potential play partners away.

[22:42] [Phoebe] Ding, ding, ding.

[22:43] [Unknown] Got it.

[22:44] [Ed] It’s not a good thing.

[22:45] [Unknown] Okay.

[22:47] [Phoebe] And where they work.
Don’t want to do that.
Yeah.

[22:50] [Ed] A lot of people don’t want to talk about their workplace or their job title or whatnot because
they’re nervous about people knowing where they work.
Right.
You know, that’s like the outside world and potentially their employment in jeopardy.
Yes.
That were to get out.

[23:06] [Phoebe] Most people are comfortable saying, I’m a doctor, I’m a nurse, I’m a, you know, I’m
law enforcement, I work at the government, I work at the county and whatever.

[23:14] [Unknown] Right.

[23:15] [Ed] And to be honest, if you’re talking to somebody at a swing event, they’re probably either
a nurse, a doctor, law enforcement or fireman, those are, or a teacher, sorry, those are
the top professions that seem to be in swinging occasionally run into accountants or lawyers
or judges.
Right.
Web developers, but it’s not as common as those first five.

[23:41] [Phoebe] Yeah.
Yeah.

[23:43] [Unknown] Definitely not.

[23:44] [Phoebe] Oh my goodness.
Okay.

[23:46] [Ed] So the next one.

[23:47] [Unknown] This is your favorite.

[23:48] [Phoebe] Chetty Ken or Chetty Kathy.

[23:51] [Unknown] Yeah.
Do not monopolize a conversation because it gets really unsexy.

[24:00] [Phoebe] We met some really, really sexy people on one of our trips to Costa Rica and we really
liked them.
But it was actually two separate couples.
The men from both of these couples were in some sort of, one was a salesman and one was
a market.
I don’t know what they were, but their jobs must have required them to talk a lot because
they talked so much.
For the first few days, I thought, oh, they’re just really nervous.
They’ll calm down.
No.
That’s just.
By day four, five, I was like, oh, you, again, the sexy meter just kept dropping and dropping
and dropping because I couldn’t get, I, they didn’t get to know me.
They just kept talking about themselves.
So by day five, I just started fucking with them.
And I said to Ed, I’m like, watch at dinner, I’m going to try and change the conversation
every single time they talk, watch.

[25:04] [Unknown] And I was just literally fucking with them trying to just, for my own humor, right, to steal

[25:12] [Phoebe] the conversation back.
These guys were good.
I will kept trying and I kept trying and they kept bringing it back and they kept bringing
it back.
I was like, they didn’t even hear me.
So after about three times, I was like, oh, now I get you, you’re not even listening
to me at all.
Right.
All right.
You just prsh, zero.
Done.
It was such a shame.

[25:35] [Ed] Yeah, it was disappointing because we’d, we’d actually started to kind of make some connections

[25:39] [Unknown] with a few of those couples and it was so weird.

[25:45] [Ed] They like just punched holes in the bottom of the boat and the whole thing just.

[25:49] [Phoebe] I never met such chatty kens in my whole life and two of them were at this.
Right.
Yeah.
Okay.
If you’re nervous, drink, smoke something, pinch yourself, ask your wife to talk for a
while or you’re a whoever.

[26:11] [Ed] Take deep breaths.

[26:12] [Phoebe] Ask more questions, right?

[26:14] [Ed] Do more listening.

[26:16] [Phoebe] Do more listening.

[26:18] [Unknown] Because you’re not going to get any action if you’re doing all the talking.

[26:28] [Guest] Here’s why we sail on Virgin.
It’s adults only.
No kids screaming at breakfast, no family buffet lines, just champagne at noon, late-night
pool parties and people who actually want to be there.
The vibe, think boutique hotel that happens to float, tattoo parlors, drag brunch, restaurants
you’d actually pay for on land.
Plus, when you’re looking to connect with other couples who know how to have fun, let’s
just say Virgin attracts a very specific type of adventurous.

[27:06] [Unknown] No wonder bread cruisers here, just your people.

[27:13] [Ed] Yeah, because people like to talk about themselves.
I get it.
But a good listener wants to hear about somebody else too.
And so if you’re doing all the talking, you’re not doing as much listening.

[27:26] [Unknown] Exactly.

[27:27] [Phoebe] And if you’re doing all the talking, you’re not doing any listening as to what she wants
when you’re down on her.
And she says, lick to the left, lick to the right, lick in the center and suck real tight.
He’s not going to hear that.

[27:41] [Ed] No.
Very important.

[27:43] [Unknown] Instructions, please pay attention.

[27:44] [Phoebe] You know, I just made that up.
That was pretty good.

[27:47] [Unknown] Mm-hmm.

[27:48] [Phoebe] I need to bring me in to write that down.
I want to say that again.

[27:51] [Guest] We can make a song out of that.

[27:53] [Unknown] All right.

[27:54] [Phoebe] Next one.
What is it?

[27:57] [Ed] Being too honest.

[27:59] [Unknown] Yeah.

[28:00] [Ed] And this is similar to the kind of the verboten subjects that we mentioned before.
You know, you don’t have to go into a bunch of detail about your family stuff.
Like the dynamics, how many kids you have, all that kind of stuff.
Don’t talk about the skeletons you’ve got in your closet.
Right?
Nothing to scare somebody off like that about all the weird, bad things that…
Yeah.
Done in your past.

[28:29] [Phoebe] We’ve had people tell us about lawsuits and I was like, hmm, yeah.
Some are interesting.
Some are a little uncomfortable, I’m like…

[28:38] [Ed] Because depending on the perspective of the person you’re talking to, just like the
forbidden subjects, maybe they don’t feel the same way as you do it.

[28:47] [Guest] You’ve now set this up as like, oh, that’s awkward, because the long and short of it is

[28:56] [Ed] to keep it sexy.

[28:59] [Phoebe] Simple.
Stupid.

[29:01] [Unknown] Yeah.

[29:03] [Phoebe] Next topic.
Nothing nice.
If you don’t have anything else nice to say, as your mom would tell you, don’t say

[29:13] [Unknown] anything.

[29:15] [Phoebe] Negative talk of others is definitely not sexy and it’s very, very off-putting.
So please, please, please, don’t do that about others.

[29:24] [Unknown] You can talk about others and say, hmm, you know, you could say, I guess how we have

[29:36] [Phoebe] warned others about others.
For example, we know of a particular gentleman who’s condom frequently tends to slip off.

[29:49] [Guest] Yes.

[29:50] [Phoebe] So I have warned one of my very good friends that of that.
And I said, he’s very nice, he’s fun to play with, but I would be careful.
Pay attention.
Pay attention.
If you want to play with him, by all means, do so, but just be aware of where the condom

[30:09] [Unknown] went.
She’s like, okay.

[30:13] [Ed] Yeah.

[30:14] [Unknown] And that’s not speaking badly of now, say, you’re not, it’s a word of caution or awareness

[30:25] [Ed] for somebody.
Right.
I guess that’s the way to do it.
When we’ve seen it, it’s, they were terrible lay, or they can’t, you know, wear-

[30:35] [Phoebe] Like, way bad, like disrespectful, not good.

[30:38] [Ed] Well, it’s kind of awkward to hear somebody else being torn down.
Right.
Secondly, you’re talking to somebody who you want to play with, and they’re thinking,
uh, am I going to be a victim of that same thing and talking to the next couple?
Right.

[30:55] [Unknown] Exactly.

[30:56] [Ed] Let’s all be honest, not everybody is a full on rock star, porn star in every sexual
encounter.
It may have been a bad night.

[31:05] [Phoebe] Right, right.
You’ve got to give people a break.
So yeah, complaining, don’t complain.
It’s not sexy.

[31:14] [Unknown] Yeah.

[31:15] [Phoebe] Okay.
Done.
We’re good.
Done.
We’re done with, uh, nothing nice to say.
Uh, the next topic, don’t get too high or too drunk because y’all know you ain’t that
sexy.
Yeah.
Not only are you not that sexy, if you go too far over the edge, you lose that connection
with someone, and we talked about this at one of our parties that we went to.
Um, friends of ours, he, he likes to smoke pot, which is fine.
I don’t have an issue with that.
But when he, he uses the parties to, to really kind of just smoke a little more, I think.
And so he, he tends to check out.
Yeah.
He’s, he’s in his own little world.
And so I can’t connect with him, therefore not sexy.

[32:01] [Ed] It basically turns into the exact opposite of chatty, Ken.
Right.

[32:07] [Phoebe] Yes.

[32:08] [Ed] Absolutely silent and almost volatose.
You can’t, you can’t engage with him.

[32:13] [Phoebe] You still can’t connect.

[32:14] [Ed] Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.

[32:17] [Unknown] So you, you lose that not to mention the fact that if you’re too drunk or too stoned

[32:22] [Ed] or whatever, a, you may not be feeling very well at the end of the night, right?
You could end up throwing up and being asked to never come back to a party.

[32:32] [Phoebe] Oh, yes.
That does happen.

[32:35] [Ed] And we’ve seen that happen a number of times.

[32:37] [Phoebe] People tend not to get asked back.

[32:39] [Unknown] So that’s kind of a, a big thing, actually.

[32:43] [Ed] Yeah.
Yeah.
So everything in moderation and long short of his, you, you want to have a good time.
So don’t overdo it.
Right.
Because you could end up with an ED situation.
You could end up with just sitting in the corner, sipping on water, hoping that the room
stopped spinning.
Oh.
Oh, golly.
Because none of that’s fun.

[33:06] [Phoebe] Or you keep yourself into a situation where you didn’t really consent to something you
normally would if you were more sober.
Right.
And then you’re sorry for about it the next day.
And that’s no fun.

[33:17] [Ed] Yeah.
You start breaking rules or boundaries or something happens, right?

[33:22] [Unknown] You just don’t know how to handle.
Exactly.
Next item.

[33:29] [Phoebe] Don’t be pushed here.
That’s right.
Sex should be fun because it is fun.
Yeah.

[33:34] [Unknown] It’s not an agenda.

[33:36] [Phoebe] And it’s not a bucket list item, although we do have bucket list items.
But we have a list, but it’s not the goal.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You have a list.
And then the night progresses, it’ll, you’re not going to the, to the event or to someone’s
house with a, oh, unless you know them really well.
And you do have a list and we did have a couple that we really knew pretty well.
And we did have a list and we’re like, okay, let’s try this next time.
That was super fun.
But generally you don’t, you, but you have your list.
And then at the end of the night, at the end of the party, you’re like, oh my god, that
was one of the things in the list.

[34:15] [Ed] Yeah.

[34:16] [Unknown] We get to check that off.

[34:18] [Ed] Yeah.
It’s super fun.

[34:20] [Unknown] We’ve had a few of those.

[34:21] [Ed] Next one.
Two flirty.

[34:23] [Unknown] That’s me.

[34:24] [Ed] If, if I drink a little bit too much, then I tend to be super flirty.
I’m flirty enough as it is, but I get even more flirty.

[34:35] [Phoebe] You get to be like the love of flirty eyes.

[34:38] [Ed] It’s a little, it’s a little off-putting to one partner and it could be off-putting.
Phoebe appreciates it to a certain degree and I think it’s fun.
But you could be off-putting to the spouse of the person who you’re flirting.
Right.
Right.
They may not be able to handle it.
Some people just don’t like that like super intimate thing and there’s a point at which

[35:01] [Unknown] it becomes awkward.
Right.

[35:05] [Phoebe] Or you start right checks that maybe it can’t be cash because you’re all in and your
partner’s like, hmm, I’m not sure yet.

[35:14] [Ed] I need to talk about this.
So.
And it’s important while you’re flirting to get to know the couple.
Yeah.
So flirting can be good because you kind of open up some doors and you set the mood and
it’s sexy, which is important.

[35:33] [Unknown] Right.
Keep the touching to an appropriate level.

[35:38] [Ed] Right.
What is that?
It kind of depends on the situation.
You can have three things.
It does.
It does.
But too much touching during conversation can be off-putting.
And not enough, maybe you’re not showing interest.

[35:52] [Unknown] So you know, touching the hand or the arm as you’re having a conversation or a little hand

[35:57] [Ed] on the knee kind of thing during conversation can be fun or dancing and when you’re dancing
all kinds of things happen with the flirting and the touch and the dress is coming up.

[36:11] [Phoebe] Or yes.

[36:12] [Unknown] More down.

[36:16] [Phoebe] Fetishes is another one.
Many do exist and not all swingers are into them.
So you know, don’t try to pressure others into one.
You know, if that happens to be your thing, but make sure they do know that you have a

[36:33] [Unknown] specific fetish and that you are currently engaging in one.

[36:39] [Phoebe] For example, the Dom and Sub role, early on, we ran into this couple where the Dom and
Sub role was actively going on that night.
And I was not allowed to talk to her only to him, but I didn’t know that.
He didn’t tell me that.
Right.
So when I talked to her, I kind of got and felt like I got in trouble and then he told
me, you can’t talk to her unless you talk to me first.
Right.
And then I felt bad because I felt like I offended them because I didn’t know and then
I felt like I should know, but because I, but I didn’t know and I’m like, why don’t
you tell me?
And so I had all these emotions that were like going back and forth, not wanting to

[37:26] [Ed] offend people, not knowing the rules and at the time, we had exactly like zero experience
with this.
Oh, yeah.

[37:36] [Phoebe] This is like one of the very first of three parties except for the whole thing that happened

[37:41] [Ed] to me in college, which is probably a whole other episode we could get into.

[37:45] [Phoebe] Well, you had a Dom sub thing in college.

[37:48] [Ed] Oh, the fetish club I went to in San Francisco for anybody who’s old school Bay area from
you think back to the mid 90s.
There was a club in San Francisco called the Trockadero and they had an event each week
called Bondage a Go-Go and it was my first exposure to the whole leather and bondage
and fun stuff.
It was hot.
Being in college and watching all that stuff going on, lots of pushed up boobs and yeah,
that was fun.
That sounds fabulous.
I don’t think it goes on anymore, but it was a thing.

[38:33] [Phoebe] All right, next one, power balance.
Most people want everyone to have a good time.
This goes kind of into what I was talking about with the fetishes.
You’ve got your dominant or submissive role.
It can be off putting or confusing.
Just make sure you know.
Tell that person, right?
And oh, the other one, the power balance.
I don’t like this one.
The director.

[39:03] [Unknown] Yes.

[39:05] [Phoebe] We ran into that a lot in the very beginning and not so much anymore.
Do this.
I want to see you lick her pussy.
Look her, touch her, kiss her.
Kiss her.
I want to see.
Do it.
Do it.
Like the guy.
I’m like, I’m not in a porn.
I’m not getting paid.
Like really?
I got to do whatever I want to do.
Oh my god, that was such a turn off.
It would make me mad.
But I don’t see or experience people doing that anymore, which is good.

[39:36] [Ed] It happens a little bit, but it’s more of like a subtle suggestion.

[39:41] [Guest] It’s less of that like, kind of a pushy thing.

[39:46] [Phoebe] Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
I did not like that one guy.
I actually happened a couple of times, but anyway, all right, everyone, thank you for
hanging in there.
The last one.

[39:57] [Ed] Done, done, done, passive participation.
So swinging takes work.
It does.
It really does.
I mean, you got it.
You got to find the events.
You’re on the prowl during the event, trying to find the right people.
You’re making conversation.
You got your A game on.

[40:17] [Phoebe] We’re constantly, we are constantly surveying the room, the entire time, hustling.

[40:25] [Ed] We, not that we’re working, but we’re working.

[40:29] [Phoebe] We are because you’re trying to meet as many people or as you can in a limited amount
of time and make a lot of great connections in a limited amount of time and hopefully make
something happen in a limited amount of time.

[40:44] [Unknown] Right.

[40:45] [Phoebe] There’s a lot to do.

[40:46] [Ed] People turn to pumpkins past a certain hour, so you’ve got to be on your game.
Yes.
And kind of the whole prep leading up to it is also a very active participation thing for
anybody who’s been on a dating site before or on a swing or site, it takes an active level
of engagement with the site following up on emails, reaching out to people constantly
working on your profile, you’ve got to add new pictures, take things down, you change
your wording, you’ve had a play experience that has changed your boundaries.
Well, you’ve got to go update your profile.
And if you’re on a couple of different sites, you’ve got two or three different sites,
you’ve got to go update, you’ve got to join groups, you’re, you know, you are moving
all the time.
It’s like any hobby, right?
You’ve got to keep working it.

[41:43] [Phoebe] You’ve got to put the investment and the time into it.
Now I will say I do have empathy for, for the people that aren’t updating their, their
profile or regular basis and things like that because, you know, you jump in and you
get overwhelmed and you jump back out for a little while and you’re not, that’s not your
main focus.
So you’ve got young kids or you’re taking care of a parent and life happens, you’ve changed
jobs and other stuff gets in the way.
You’re not on a site every week or every day or even once a month.
Absolutely.
But when you do decide that you want to jump back in and you want to start, you know,
getting more, yeah, stoking the fire, you probably have to be on a minimum once a week,
minimum.

[42:26] [Unknown] Yeah.

[42:27] [Ed] And, and, you know, you go in, you hadn’t been on in a while to update your email, make
sure that you’re, you’re reaching out to people who you’re interested in and, you know,
if, if you choose to, you can also let people down gently if you’re not interested.
But yeah, like when you’re on there, take care of your business and move along.
There’s also the whole aspect of creating communication accounts, so me, we, those kinds
of things, it’s a way to stay engaged kind of outside of the normal swing sites.
Right.
You’ve made a connection with somebody and you want to maintain that connection.

[43:09] [Phoebe] Yep.
You check in.
Yeah.
So as you start to go to more parties, go to more events, meet more people, get connected,
you know, it just starts to build and build and build and build and then, then you start,
you know, staying in touch and staying in touch and then all of a sudden people are reaching

[43:25] [Unknown] out to you for a party and, you know, things like that.

[43:29] [Ed] And most importantly, if you want to stay in this for a while, you’ve got to make connections
when you attend parties, you go to a party, you make those friends and you find out about
other parties and those parties you find about other ones and you start to build up your
network.

[43:47] [Guest] Exactly.

[43:48] [Ed] Well, I was just saying, I think I jumped ahead of you a little bit, yeah.
Those connections are important and parties are a good way to make those connections because
definitely you find out about more parties.

[43:59] [Phoebe] Right, right, right.
Oh my goodness, that was a long list, but really, really good.
Hopefully this helps you get the swing back in your swing game.
Have fucking fun.

[44:12] [Ed] Specifically, fucking fun.

[44:13] [Phoebe] Yeah.
Thanks for listening, everyone.
This is Ed.
And Phoebe Singh.

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[45:20] [Unknown] Oh, one last thing before you go.

[45:35] [Ed] If this episode helped you in any way, the single best thing you can do to support the
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[45:48] [Unknown] education.

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[45:57] [Unknown] All the instructions are there.

[46:00] [Ed] Thank you for being part of this community.
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